r/MadeMeSmile
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u/StcStasi
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8d ago
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Twins separated at birth, meeting for the first time after one twin was automatically tagged as the other on social media, despite being on opposite sides of the country and being in closed adoptions. Wholesome Moments
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u/GCSS-MC 8d ago
Don't tell your friends you found your long lost twin. Just start pulling elaborate pranks on them.
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u/old_school_z 8d ago
Hey guys, you aren't going to believe this, but I've got teleportation figured out...
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u/dynex811 8d ago
Damn I want to recommend a movie about this but it will spoil the twist lol
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u/turnermagerger 8d ago •
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But imagine the prestige from your suggestion
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u/majort94 8d ago
Some things should be left as cinema magic
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u/NotFromStateFarmJake 8d ago
You don’t even need to steal it with a five finger discount. Probably only need 3 or so
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u/already-registered 8d ago •
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spoiler police will get you and nobodys going to bale you out!
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u/BoomsandBlooms 8d ago
Can you pm me the movie title pls?
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u/IdoNOThateNEVER 8d ago edited 8d ago
Guys! Here it is with a spoiler tag for anyone else wondering. Don't ask individually this same dude.
The Prestige
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u/inplayruin 8d ago
Alternatively, commit the perfect crime. "Why no officer, I don't know how my fingerprints and DNA got inside that bank vault. As you can see, I was on an airplane 1200 miles away at the time of the robbery. Twin? No ma'am, I am an only child. Says so right here on my parents' tax filings. Must be something shady going on at the crime lab."
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u/gibson_mel 8d ago
Nope. Fingerprints on every person is unique - even identical twins.
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u/scottonaharley 8d ago edited 8d ago
While you are correct, they actually do start out completely identical in every way. However during gestation slight differences in the womb contribute to the differences in the fingerprints of identical twins and even some differences in DNA.
So the short answer is that they start out precisely the same but environmental differences during development contributes to and create differences.
Edit:Forgot article Link https://now.northropgrumman.com/do-identical-twins-have-the-same-dna/
Edit2:comma and words for clarity
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u/pyronius 8d ago
The police: "Oh. Well, looks like your DNA is also a perfect match for this other guy. So, one of you is going to prison."
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u/humangingercat 8d ago
Actually, I believe in that case when they can't determine which of the twins did it, they go free. Supposedly.
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u/ueberbelichtetesfoto 8d ago
Which is correct, because it's innocent until proven guilty (or it should be at least).
Btw: Identical twins have different fingerprints.
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u/mrshulgin 8d ago edited 8d ago
My Philosophy of Law professor hated that phrase (not calling you out at all -- everyone uses it constantly).
It should be innocent unless proven guilty. "Until" just reinforces the idea that "if they were arrested they must be guilty!"
Even if we can't prove it now, it's only a matter of time until we prove that you're guilty.
edited for typo
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u/Supercoolguy7 8d ago
Yeah knowing there's a 50/50 shot you got the wrong person is definitely a reasonable doubt that should prevent conviction
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u/Ameya93 8d ago
What is my perfect crime? I break into Tiffany's at midnight. Do I go for the vault? No, I go for the chandelier. It's priceless. As I'm taking it down, a woman catches me. She tells me to stop. It's her father's business. She's Tiffany. I say no. We make love all night. In the morning, the cops come and I escape in one of their uniforms. I tell her to meet me in Mexico, but I go to Canada. I don't trust her. Besides, I like the cold. Thirty years later, I get a postcard. I have a son and he's the chief of police. This is where the story gets interesting. I tell Tiffany to meet me in Paris by the Trocadero. She's been waiting for me all these years. She's never taken another lover. I don't care. I don't show up. I go to Berlin. That's where I stashed the chandelier.
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u/Keios80 8d ago
Identical twins don't have identical fingerprints. There's probably a longwinded explanation as to why, but I don't know it.
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u/Fit-Seaworthiness712 8d ago
Fingerprints are made from amniotic fluid swirling around when you’re a fetus. They’re not made by dna so that how everybody has different ones because fluid isn’t going to swirl the same unless you’re in the exact same spot and position even if you share a sac
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u/Interesting-Drink291 8d ago
It’s crazy how they even have similar style without knowing each other at all.
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u/-CluelessWoman- 8d ago
I don’t remember their names but I’ve read a true story once of twins girls who were separated at birth and when they met for the first time, they were dressed identically by pure coincidence.
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u/eva_rector 8d ago edited 8d ago
There's another one about a pair of male twins who were separated at birth, reunited fifty-odd years later, and found out that they liked the same teams, favored the same beer, had married women with the same first name, and had kids with the same names. Biology is WEIRD, y'all.
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u/pantijose 8d ago
Yes! There is a longitudinal study on twins, especially identical, who were separated at birth. Psychologists use this study to examine the roles of nature vs nurture, among other topics.
There are so many wild stories from that study. Truly one of the most interesting ones out there.
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u/PokeYa 8d ago
If I’m remembering correctly, it’s also like one of the most unethical or controversial, but I could be thinking about another
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u/queefer_sutherland92 8d ago edited 8d ago
You’re correct. It’s human experimentation with non-consenting parties — namely children.
The study you’re thinking of was probably the Minnesota Twin Family Study. The Wikipedia page isn’t very informative re: ethics, but I’ve definitely read the about the ethical issues with it before.The most famous case from this study is the triplets that were separated at birth and randomly met again in university. One of the triplets ultimately killed themselves.
Edit: the reason the wiki page didn’t mention ethical concerns was because I was thinking of a different study lol.
The study I’m thinking of was run by this guy: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_B._Neubauer
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u/mostlynotbroken 8d ago
These are two different things. The MN Twins study has done lots of research, but all thoroughly vetted and above board through the university. https://mctfr.psych.umn.edu/
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u/poopdood696969 8d ago
Yeah, the documentary about it is Three Identical Strangers (i think). I think we are pretty close to the results of the study becoming available.
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u/actuallyiamafish 8d ago
It's shit like this that makes me wonder if free will is even a thing.
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u/trombone_womp_womp 8d ago
I was listening to an argument yesterday that we have very little agency due to a combination of biological + societal factors. Super weird to think about.
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u/GhettoStatusSymbol 8d ago
Not to mention the atoms in our brain follow the laws of physics like every other atom
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u/zanzebar 8d ago •
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u/NoBarsHere 8d ago
If the video doesn't load for you, like it didn't for me, here's a direct link: https://cdn.jwplayer.com/videos/GPfwoEE6-dQvG2wWW.mp4
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u/stonecutter7 8d ago
I dont know if this makes sense, but they look like twins--even when they are alone.
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u/grundelgrump 8d ago
I don't know if it's cause I'm a twin and just biased. But I know exactly what you mean lmao
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u/Dbahnsai 8d ago
I have an older half brother that I always knew about, but had never met. His mom's family hated my dad, he was 19 and they convinced him to sign away his parental rights. My sister as a teenager found our brother on Myspace one day and sent him and his girlfriend a message just basically saying hi and explaining who she was. Apparently he didn't even know my dad's name until a family friend accidently let it slip one day.
When we went up to meet him after all the initial awkward messages and phone calls, my dad was wearing a blue button shirt and khaki shorts. His drink of choice was Mnt. Dew, and he was a mechanic. My brother was wearing a blue button shirt, khaki pants, his drink of choice was Mnt. Dew, and his job was an auto body mechanic.
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u/Green_Doubt5717 8d ago edited 8d ago
I’ve got a sibling that I didn’t know existed until I was out of high school. We met a few times but neither of us were in a place to really build a relationship. We randomly reconnected by running into each other unexpectedly and the reunion was much like this. I’ve never had anyone hug me to tight in my life. It’s like that every time we see each other now.
We aren’t twins, but this video hit me right in the feels. The look in their eyes and the aggressive bear hugs they give was identical to what I experienced. Really hope these two have been able to grow close and reconnect.
Edit: wow, the outpouring of others having similar situations is beyond heartwarming and makes me feel a lot better about the situation. It was a tough few years before we reconnected again, and I knew no one else who could relate to the situation. Thank you to everyone who shared and know you aren’t alone in this!
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u/Enter-Username69 8d ago
Did both of your adopted parents know about the other sibling? I'm curious if the parents of the twins knew about the other one or if it just just as much of a surprise!
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u/Green_Doubt5717 8d ago
We weren’t adopted, we are actually half siblings. My siblings mother and my father had a fling before my parents met. My dad had no idea about it being his kid, but knew she had been pregnant. She had told him repeatedly for years it wasn’t his kid but it came out that my dad was the father once my siblings mother died. My sibling was told as a teenager but was told to keep it secret. Kind of a weird situation, especially since we lived in the same town and even just a few blocks away growing up.
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u/impressive_specimen 8d ago edited 8d ago
Just after graduating, dad confessed he had a secret child. One other sibling knew about, but the other six(three full blooded siblings, three half siblings) didn't know until his funeral.
The executor of his estate managed to arrange a meeting with the kid, gave him some of dads things, but they had no interest in meeting any of us other kids.
Then about five years ago one of the half siblings got a message from those DNA places saying someone was looking for their father and we were a familial hit, but that time it turned out to be an uncles.
Sometimes these things can be wonderful reunions. Other times they can just be an example of how messed up familial ties can be.
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u/MacAttack2015 8d ago
I was adopted at birth (closed adoption) but my bio parents stayed together and had another son before they eventually decided to part ways. He never knew about me and vice versa, until I started doing some online sleuthing with some limited information I had post-college. We just met for the first time in April 2022 and got to see each other again in September. Tightest, longest hugs of my life. There is nothing else like it.
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u/Not_Discordia 8d ago
Wow as a twin this rocked me to my core.
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u/flimbs 8d ago •
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I feel the same as you.
Is what I imagine your twin would say.
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u/BrownSugarBare 8d ago
Separating twins seems atrociously cruel. The idea of being separated from the being that you literally were birthed with is just horrifying.
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u/funny-hats-only 8d ago
I still remember being devastated when me and my twin sister were separated into different kindergarten classes. And that was one room away.
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u/Not_Discordia 8d ago
Yeah when I was a kid, they separated twins as a rule, I hated it.
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u/transcendanttermite 8d ago
Our twin daughters demanded to be separated at the start of second grade. Didn’t share a classroom again until just by pure chance their sophomore year of high school…and they didn’t like it then either!
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u/fox_ontherun 8d ago
That too, but also, what a mind fuck not knowing you're a twin but having someone looking exactly like you, and having your exact DNA, just walking around out there. People would think they know you, your partner could think you're cheating, you could go down for their crime stuff... You'd start thinking you're going crazy
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u/Kingstakk 8d ago •
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Me as well. My twin passed away in 2021, a month after our 30th birthday. I thought we would both live until much older or I never really thought about him dying before it happened. Its a type of loss I wouldn't wish on anyone. Losing a brother or sister is tough, but losing a twin? The person I shared a bunk bed with. The person who shared every moment a person goes through growing up. We got off the bus together everyday. We got our licenses at the same time. We even got our first job at the same place on the same day. Treasure your twins! One day, one of you will pass much too soon. I'm not sure which is worse, dying or being alive without your other half. Now, I live every single day as kind, honest, and loving as I can be as a way to honor his memory.
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u/Not_Discordia 8d ago
I’m so fucking sorry, I literally feel sick thinking of being in your position as a twin. I know exactly what you mean, my twin and I mostly have lived very very close by each other, we even worked together in the same company for 11 years. I treasure mine, I know one of us will go first, we both always say we hope we are the one who does so that we don’t have to live without the other.
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u/FuzzballLogic 8d ago
They’re identical twins, which is as close to a clone you can get without actually cloning someone. As a twin, would you consider their reunion as becoming “whole” again, finding that missing piece to your puzzle?
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u/BreakingThoseCankles 8d ago
I thought of the hug as them back in the womb... Just embracing each other after all those years of missing "that piece"
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u/weekend_religion 8d ago
I'm sure I'm over analyzing. But the way twin 1 hugged himself right before he walked up to twin 2 made me think maybe he naturally self soothes that way because of how twins sometimes embrace in the womb.
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u/Maximum_Knee_4622 8d ago
There's stories of identical twins claiming they could tell when their other identical twin passed away so yeah apparently it's a pretty significant bond.
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u/Another-Story 8d ago
SAME ;_; I've been living in across the ocean from my other half for a year now and i finally get to see her again in April. I will definitely be a mess lol.
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u/lERVOOl 8d ago
Anyone got the complete story? This is really interesting
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u/dreamrock 8d ago
They met in the Bronx.
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u/Apocalypse-7 8d ago
that about sums up the story, thanks for that
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u/rinkypinkpanther 8d ago
Don't be fooled by the twin that he's got, he's still Jimmy from the block
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u/RadiantZote 8d ago
They were actually never separated at birth and made it all up for the lols because people eat this shit up
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u/Kommander-in-Keef 8d ago
What are you talking about this happens all the time. Haven’t you ever seen that documentary, Sister Sister??
Shaking up that family tree with sister synchronicity?!
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u/SyntaxError_22 8d ago
Three Identical Strangers is also a very interesting documentary.
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u/ForWhomTheBoneBones 8d ago
Oof. The least interesting thing about that documentary is that three identical brothers find each other. Buckle up.
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u/MonsieurGideon 8d ago edited 8d ago •
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Sadly I found out they were separated at birth due to their biological mother passing away during childbirth and their biological father not being around anymore and from the sounds of it he got wrapped up in some criminal stuff.
The first brother you see at the beginning was raised on a farm by his aunt and uncle, until tragically they were found dead from a house fire. After that he went off and got involved in religion.
The second brother had been adopted by a well off family that were pretty involved in local politics in the area, until the town was completely destroyed by the death star.
Now they are both part of the rebel alliance.
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u/HBTFD_Kirby 8d ago
Damn got me
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u/rhinolz 8d ago
Had me right up until the Death Star. If he said a terrorist bombing I probably would still be believing it.
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u/detto79 8d ago
Fucking BRAVO. I actually started to feel emotional until that last line. You got me 100%
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u/nick_soapdish_ 8d ago
Damn it. I thought I had identified a shittymorph before I got caught. Was waiting for the 'In nineteen ninety eight' to come up.
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u/zerodowns 8d ago
Reminds me of the documentary Three identical strangers where three identical triplets separated while they were young found each other.
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u/WhatsGoingOn1879 8d ago
I had to watch it in my AP English course and write about it. One of my favorite documentaries but a very very very fucked up story
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u/zerodowns 8d ago
Psychology and sociology for me.
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u/WhatsGoingOn1879 8d ago
That’s where I watched it the second and third time, respectively. Crazy how that film can fill so many different subjects. I heard from a buddy he got to see it in his biology class.
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u/Designer_Exam2548 8d ago
What kind of adoption process separates newborn twins?
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u/garfield_eyes 8d ago
There’s actually a documentary called “Three Identical Strangers” that is about triplets separated at birth and an adoption agency that separated multiples on purpose as an experiment on nature/nurture. It’s really sad but an interesting watch.
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u/Thestohrohyah 8d ago
Oh ok so someone decided to entrust Vault-Tec with children in need of families?
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u/WhovianRavenclaw 8d ago
Vault-tec would consider separating twins too humane for their experiments.
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u/AstralGlaciers 8d ago
Honestly yeah a pretty good comparison. They deliberately put the kids in homes of varying backgrounds and wealth to see how it'd affect them developmentally. 'Scientists' visited them during childhood several times under the guise of health workers to monitor their psychological progress. Several of the people who worked on this programme showed no remorse at all. There's so much more in the documentary, it made me angry to find out what they did. It's definitely worth a watch.
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u/Hamster422 8d ago
Fantastic documentary, unbelievable story but yeah pretty sad outcome
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u/zootnotdingo 8d ago
I didn’t expect it to be so sad, but I supposed I should have guessed. You can’t do that to children and have them turn out well
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u/7GatesOfHello 8d ago edited 8d ago
Purely a guess, and I suspect someone with better knowledge will jump in... Adoptions seek placement in good homes quickly as their first priority and keeping twins together as their second priority. Not all parents of adopted children are able to take two children at once, especially if the children have not had time to bond their personalities together as same-age siblings. Again, just a guess.
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u/Puptentjoe 8d ago
I get that but shouldn't there be something saying they should at least know about each other? Something?! Like lets say I could only take one I'd definitely want the other to know they have a brother.
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u/7GatesOfHello 8d ago
What I'm hearing is a desire for a "closed adoption with notification of siblings at 18" which, again without me having any substantial understanding of the system(s), may be difficult to implement. For example, how would the originating agency know how to contact the now-adults if the adopting parents don't disclose the specific nature of their relationship to the adopted person? I understand that "where there's a will, there's a way" but the lack of existence of such a feature is not entirely surprising to me.
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u/Red__Spider__Lily 8d ago edited 8d ago
Not sure on the us, but here in Brazil that's illegal, siblings must always be adopted together. I remember when i was in foster care(i don't know the name in engliah of the place) there was 5 siblings, all starting with the letter K in name rhat were called family K. I got adopted way earlier but 2 years later when I met the woman that took care of administration told.me they were all adopted. I was honestly happy because their chance sas3not good. Hope everything worked out for them.
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u/HomieApathy
8d ago
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Damn it. Straight up crying on the toilet at work
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u/InVodkaVeritas 8d ago
I'm a mom of twin sons (8 year olds) and I'm crying at my desk right now.
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u/Blahblahnownow 8d ago
Mom of 2.5 year old twins, also in tears. I can’t imagine them separated at birth. It just breaks my heart.
Yesterday one of mine stayed home due to illness and the other one was a mess at daycare apparently 💔
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u/minjis1 8d ago
Hope you dont work on Amazon
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u/LordValcron 8d ago
LOL! This was the first comment I read and im doing exactly the same.
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u/Embarrassed-Scale339 8d ago
How do they already have the same haircut tho lol
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u/CantBeCanned 8d ago
They do have the exact same hair texture, so that helps it to look so alike. But this style is common with curly haired guys because they don't have to comb their hair back and try to make it stay in place.
Light blue jacket twin's hair looks more cleaned up in the back
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u/Liz4984 8d ago
There are numerous psychology studies about separated twins. Its VERY common for them to have similar styles, jobs, house types, etc.
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u/FuzzballLogic 8d ago
You saw those families where identical twins married identical twins? Both couples had kids who were officially cousins but biologically siblings.
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u/jakeandwally 8d ago
It would be like you were missing a part of yourself and you found it.
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u/smoked_papchika 8d ago
When he hugged himself after pointing his twin out, that’s exactly what I thought. Almost like he could feel what was missing in the core of his being.
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u/Head-Advantage2461 8d ago
Separating twins seems like a horrible idea. Maybe there was no choice. So glad they found each other. And I hate that music.
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u/up_N2_no_good 8d ago
I need more of this story.
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u/Shipwrecking_siren 8d ago
I can only find this Reddit video so feels a bit suss.
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u/militantnegro_IV 8d ago edited 8d ago
Can someone name a social media site that would actually tag you like this? The ones I've used would only do this with people in my actual friends list, not strangers across the country.
Doesn't seem plausible. I've taken enough crowd pictures at concerts and in clubs with strangers in the background and never had any site auto tag one of these randoms and inform them. If that was the case catfishing would be eradicated overnight.
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u/reallovesurvives 8d ago
The video itself seems a little off too. Like the guy seems a little forced with his emotion and the stuff he’s saying. And the other guy just staring out into the River not anxiously turning around waiting or anything.
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u/supernasty 8d ago
Yeah that stare out at the river is the type of move u see in a movie lol all that was missing was 10 different angles in slow motion of him turning around and a big bright light behind him. The internet has ruined me
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u/totallynotstefan 8d ago edited 7d ago
Twins with struggling social media profiles stage an emotional meeting, decades in the making, despite sharing an apartment in the Bronx and alternating shifts at the same bodega.
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u/umbrajoke 8d ago
I wish it didn't feel produced to me.
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u/Sleyvin 8d ago
It kinda does, yeah. It's the small details but the fact the other twin was facing the ocean like in a movie. Me too, when I want to meet someone important somewhere, I always make sure to not look for the other person and only show my back.
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u/Vic__Rattlehead 8d ago
It gives strong ass staged as fk vibes doesn't it?
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u/YesilFasulye 8d ago
It really does. I want to believe this is 100% real, but it screams this wasn't 100% authentic.
"Hey, I will agree to meet you, but only if you agree to meet at this spot and face the water until I finally approach."
The guy also sounds like the same person in a gay porn studio that also films in this manner.
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u/SweetBunny8 8d ago
It's the casual: I'm just looking at the view before the surprised Oh my gosh, no way, it's my twin!
...While his friend on the bench was already filming and the other guy is slowly turning the camera around them dramatically...
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u/BruderBobody 8d ago
I like how the other twin is looking out on the water and not looking for his twin he is supposed to meet. This really doesn’t seem real.
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u/biasdetklias 8d ago
I'm an identical twin and this hits the feelings.
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u/JohnExcrement 8d ago
My grandkids are identical twins and just the idea of them not having the lives they’ve had together so far makes we want to weep.
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u/birbobirby 8d ago
As a twin, whoever separated them. Fuck you.
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u/Breaking-Dad- 8d ago
Who the fuck splits up twins. I know siblings sometimes have to be separated but twins? Seriously?
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u/batmanAPPROVED
8d ago
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This feels….strangely staged. Maybe just me but something is off.
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u/SirLesbian 8d ago
It's not you. This video has made its rounds on reddit before and the last time it was posted people figured out that it was staged by going to the guy's social media page. It's annoying that I can't find the post now.
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u/BesottedScot 8d ago
How would social media automatically tag someone you're not friends with too? It doesn't just suggest anyone in the world.
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u/luckytraptkillt 8d ago
I agree. Something about the way the first guy is walking up just has “content creator” voice going on. I mean sweet video and messaging but I’m with you.
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u/justin_tino 8d ago
The music, the unnecessary camera movement. If it’s not staged I’d just be bummed my long lost twin is a wannabe influencer.
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u/UsagiElk 8d ago
Thats what I thought too. Their reactions to seeing each other seems genuine though so I’m confused
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u/Caleth 8d ago
The one we follow might well be some kind of content creator or wannabe who isn't going to pass up the chance to make hay out of this.
But if you look in the video other twin clearly has someone filming him too. So it could also be they've just consumed enough social media they are unconciously aping what they see?
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u/Coral_Blue_Number_2 8d ago
Or they both wanted to record the reaction of their friend meeting their twin. I would record that interaction personally.
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u/Agonizingmilk404 8d ago
Other twin just obliviously staring into the river
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u/vghsthrowaway_11 8d ago
Nah that part I get. Don't want to stand facing where the person you're meeting might come from, because then you see them from dozens of yards away and have to decide whether to meet them in the middle or come to where you are. Definitely something I'd think too hard about.
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u/reddit_beer_map 8d ago
I'm guessing that twin was also trying to calm themselves and psych themselves up to prepare for the meeting.
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u/jz0089 8d ago
yeah I dont know if it was the dumb music or the extended prologue.
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u/Diabl21693 8d ago
I think you’re right because I’ve been looking for a follow up on this and can’t find anything.
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u/ListenToThatSound 8d ago
Anything on something along the lines of "Hey I know these guys, we went to the same school together, they were never separated at birth” or anything like that?
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u/Franhamery 8d ago
LOOK HOW SIMILAR THEY DRESSED LMAO
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u/Little_miss_wendy 8d ago
I noticed that too. It reminded me of a PBS special I watched 15-20 years ago about twins and there these two little old lady twins who had been seperated for decades, living on separate continents, and they ended up wearing pretty much identical outfits to the interview with no preplanning. I’m not saying this video isn’t staged, I’m just saying having identical dna is a very weird thing and contributes to some weird things.
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u/Ice_Burn 8d ago
My ex mother in law is an identical twin. Her sister stayed in the little town in Iowa where they were raised. She and her husband bought the family farm from their parents. Mom in law married a professor who took teaching assignments all over the world and lived a cosmopolitan life. In the time before the internet, they’d change their hair style significantly before a family reunion and it would be exactly the same as each other. Stuff like that would happen all the time.
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u/theperfectlysadhuman 8d ago
Yeah I think it's the way it's filmed, it kinda looks too 'prepared'. Could be also simply because camera guy is a film student or a film enthusiast l.
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u/_userlame 8d ago
They have the exact same pants and shoes on, could be a crazy coincidence but chances are more likely its just staged.
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u/scaredshtlessintx 8d ago edited 8d ago
As a twin…this legit made me ball…and BAWL.
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u/jakeandwally 8d ago
I’m crying my eyes out. Wow.
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u/LoveVirginiaTech 8d ago
Same. Funny how this keeps happening in a sub named MadeMeSmile!
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u/Oilmoneyy 8d ago
Ngl, I'm a trucker and I fucked up watching this video in the lunchroom with my coworkers. Had to blame it on my contact lenses.
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u/wabbadubdubb 8d ago
I don’t think I’d want to meet my long lost twin if I had one. I just don’t want to be the fat twin.
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u/JustCannotThink 8d ago
You could insist that they get to a certain weight before you meet up.
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u/likwidsylvur 8d ago
That's awesome but why would you split up twins.... you gotta keep the back up organs near incase of accidents /s
But seriously beyond adoption complications as a whole. Why would you split them, they must have felt something was off their whole life.
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